Live Blissed Out
Live Blissed Out
056 - Gentle Marketing
Joining me is Sarah Santacroce.
12 years of running an Online LinkedIn Consulting business inspired a yearning in Sarah to create a global movement that encourages people to bring more empathy and kindness to business & marketing. She calls it The Gentle Business Revolution™.
Besides a podcast with the same name Sarah is currently working on a book to inspire heart-centered entrepreneurs to question their assumptions when it comes to marketing & give them permission to market their business their way!
Sarah shares a fresh perspective and doesn’t shy away from calling things out that no longer work for many of us when it comes to the current Online Marketing model. Think ‘Seth Godin’ with a feminine touch.
She loves thought-provoking conversations that invite listeners to question assumptions about the techniques they currently use to communicate with their ideal clients and how this ‘marketing mask’ affects the quality and joy of running their business. By giving examples of fear and manipulation based techniques she will demonstrate a reframe and prove that a ‘gentler’ approach to marketing is not only possible, but will guarantee a more sustainable business.
When she’s not working, she loves adventure & traveling, yoga & nature walks or hanging out with her family.
OFFER:
The 1-Page Gentle Marketing Plan in the form of a mandala: http://www.sarahsantacroce.com/1page
Check out Sarah’s Podcast, The Gentle Business Revolution Show!
To learn more, visit www.sarahsantacroce.com
In this episode we will cover:
- Distinguishing Between Marketing & Sales
- A Dirty Word?
- Today's Conscious Customers
- Following The Herd
- Feel Good Marketing
- Knowing Yourself
- The 7 P's Of Marketing
- Partnerships
- Discounts
Thanks so much for tuning in again this week. I appreciate you :)
Have some feedback you’d like to share? Leave a note in the Feedback section.
Special thanks to Sarah Santacroce for being on the show.
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Welcome to Episode 56 on the Live Blissed Out podcast. Did you know that lack of empathy and authenticity are two reasons why people dislike marketing? Hello action takers! Welcome to Live Blissed Out. A podcast where I have inspirational and informational conversations with business owners and subject matter experts to help us get the scoop and the lowdown on a variety of topics. Tired of hesitating or making decisions without having the big picture? Want to be in the know? Then this is the place to go. I'm your host Marisa Huston. Helping achieve bliss through awareness and action. Thanks for joining me. The information opinions and recommendations presented in this podcast are for general information only. And any reliance on the information provided in this podcast is done at your own risk. This podcast should not be considered professional advice. Joining me is Sarah Santacroce. 12 years of running an online LinkedIn consulting business inspired a yearning in Sarah to create a global movement that encourages people to bring more empathy and kindness to business and marketing. She calls it the Gentle Business Revolution TM. Besides a podcast with the same name, Sarah is currently working on a book to inspire heart-centered entrepreneurs to question their assumptions when it comes to marketing and give them permission to market their business their way. She loves thought-provoking conversations that invite listeners to question assumptions about the techniques they currently use to communicate with their ideal clients and how this marketing mask affects the quality and joy of running their business. By giving examples of fear and manipulation based techniques, she will demonstrate a reframe and prove that a gentler approach to marketing is not only possible, but will guarantee a more sustainable business. Download your free one page gentle marketing plan at www.sarahsantacroce.com/1page. Ccheck out her podcast The Gentle Business Revolution Show. To learn more visit www.sarasantacroce.com. Would you like to belong to a community of partners that helps impact 15,000 children in the state of Colorado, Kenzi's Causes is an organization dedicated to putting smiles on the faces of low income children in Colorado. Their mission is to support underprivileged children and their families by providing toys, food and more during the holidays, school supplies and clothing during the school year, and assisting families through community outreach, financial planning and professional support. To learn more about this amazing organization and how you can make a difference, click the link in the show notes or visit www.kenziscauses.org. Sarah, it's so nice to have you here today. Thank you for taking the time to chat with me.
Sarah Santacroce :It's a pleasure to be here. Marisa, I'm so excited to do this with you!
Marisa Huston :Oh, me too, because the topic we're going to be talking about is gentle marketing. And I wanted to start the conversation by defining what marketing is because I do believe there are people out there that have a tough time distinguishing the difference between sales and marketing. So I think it's important to establish exactly what the role of marketing is in business.
Sarah Santacroce :The one word that really comes to my mind when I think about marketing is connection. Connection and communication two words with C's, so connecting with your ideal clients, ideal customers, and then the second C, communicating. Really establishing a relationship and yes, communicating about you know, your services about who you are about your story, and all of that. And maybe a salesperson would define it differently, but for me, marketing is what leads them to a sales conversation. First you establish the relationship, you connect, you communicate. And then if the ideal client is ready to have a conversation about you know, working with you, that's when the sales then started. And that's where you really talk about the price and what's included and all of that. And in my sense, gentle sales conversation will still be about relationships and communicating and connecting. It's almost like the sales decision has already been made in your marketing part in that piece. So if you do apply gentle marketing, people who come to you and are ready for a sales conversation, they're already almost sold because they are resonating with you at such a deep level that you don't have to like go into the script of like that we know from sales and you know, talk about the pain and all of this crazy stuff that we hate so much. Because they've already almost decided that they want to work with you. I think the distinction is so much different from before. This is the marketing department and this is the sales department. They should work together much more than they have in the past. Really?
Marisa Huston :Yeah, I think they kind of blend in, which is I think why people are so confused. People actually want to talk to you about the sale after they've been attracted to you in some way and marketing basically gives them that attraction. It tells them, we're the right fit, this is who we serve and if you can relate to that, that would be more enticing. That would give you a reason to pick up the phone and want to listen to what you have to say about how the product can help them. Then I think that in the sales piece, when you actually communicate the benefits of the product, if you miss the mark? So for example, if they thought they were going to get x, but apparently that's not what you offer, that's where you could probably lose them. But as long as your marketing message is in line with your sales, then they work very well together. Why does it seem to be such a dirty word anymore? When you say marketing, it almost feels sleazy? And sales is the same way? Why is that?
Sarah Santacroce :I really think it's because we've kind of lost this connection to the human being in marketing and we've been taught me included, I always say when I talk about gentle marketing, I started out that way. I started out like most of us following what the big marketing gurus told us to do. And for me, that's been 12 years, I've been running an online LinkedIn consulting business. And so from the beginning, it was all about how can we sell more? How can we get more clients? It was always about more and more and faster. And so we kind of lost this human connection. It started to feel really pushy. It started to feel like there's too much automation. And so the customer felt like a number rather than, you know, your ideal client. And and so this pushiness, and hype and hustle, that's what gentle marketers feel so averse by. They're like, I don't want to do this. And that's why they think of marketing as dirty. And so that's what I'm on a mission to change and really say you can do marketing in an authentic way, by using more empathy and kindness.
Marisa Huston :We all need to make sales in order for our businesses to succeed and marketing is a big part of that. That's how we attract people to us. In this day and age, there's so many choices. There's an abundance of people that do the same thing or very similar service, and we need to stand out. And because of that competition, people feel pressured. They need to get that next customer. They have a limited timeframe and they feel like if I'm not moving the needle, by this time, I may not even have a business. So there's this pressure. And then it comes across in the way that they market. And you can see the authenticity is gone. So how do we know that this type of gentler marketing will work for people to still be able to get to the goals that they wanna get without feeling like they're being pushy, or sacrificing their authenticity?
Sarah Santacroce :Today's conscious customer is much smarter than even just 10 years ago. Like we have access to so much information and we want to really work with people who are not just experts in their field. Our logical our left brain will scan for that, does this person know what they do? But our right brain is much more active nowadays, with this change to a more intuitive age. And our right brain is looking for the connection and authenticity and the feelers go out there and look for is this right? Is she real? Or is this all a big spiel to just get me to click or get me to buy? And so that's why I know that it is working. And he might be working a bit more slowly, I'll give you that. Because developing relationships takes a bit more time. But the thing is, when we push our clients into buying and we use fear based approaches, we use manipulation, we might get a more immediate sale. And often these sales are actually only working if we actually also use discounts. So that's what we've also been taught to do in marketing. Oh, just put the, you know, discount or only now and only four seats available and got to get this now that we're using these fear based methods that yes, they will get us cash in the door, but they are not helping us build a sustainable business. Because these are clients who are coming into our business with this fear with this scarcity thinking and so A they're not going to probably refer us to other clients or if they do they refer us to other fear based clients. And B they're not going to get the results we actually want them to get. Because if people act from fear and they buy from fear, and I noticed for myself, I've bought so many products in the past where I was like, Oh yeah, I gotta get this because I need this now. And then you realize that you come from fear and then you actually can't do it because you somehow block and so this fear really blocks you and that leads us to not be able to build a sustainable business. It's not long term oriented. So from these different factors, we know that the slower way that more gentle way, the more human way and relationship way is really the only way to go forward. We're recording this and it's still, you know, in the middle of this COVID crisis. And I don't know if you've noticed, as Marisa, people's values change in a crisis like that. And so they want the truth more than ever before. And so if they can just feel that you're slightly off, or that you're trying to trick them just a little bit, they will know. And so I really think going forward, the only way is the gentle way and the honest way.
Marisa Huston :I think that our listeners are going to relate to this. I don't think there's anyone out there that hasn't been burned in some way. We have all fallen for that trap. Some of us more than others. But we've all been in situations where we've been promised, especially when a business is struggling. You feel more desperate. You're looking for answers, and somebody out there seems to be saying the perfect thing to you. I am going to turn your business around and within five months, you're going to be making six figures. And if you would only invest this many thousand right now I'm going to make that up then fold or tell you all the things you want to hear because they know you're in a very gullible state. And they're taking advantage of that. And then you buy into it and you realize that it was all hype. They really didn't give you what you needed and now you have less money than you ever had before, because you invested a huge sum hoping this was going to be the breakthrough. And it's heart wrenching. And then on top of which, if you've been victimized like that, then it's hard for you to trust again. Because how do you know that the next person isn't saying those same things. And so when you do find an authentic person, somebody who genuinely cares, and will not just tell you magic miracles are going to happen, but really be honest with you and tell you that work is required. Because at the end of the day, Sarah, we have to put work in. I wish we could wave a wand and say tomorrow, everything that you hoped and wished for in your business is going to turn out great. That's not reality. And if somebody's telling you that that's another red flag, don't you think?
Sarah Santacroce :So yeah, we have been burned buying products from other people. And I always also say, It's okay, if you have used some of these tactics in your own emails, or in your own web pages, because that's what we've been taught to do. And I was among the first to kind of go, that doesn't really feel right doing/saying this. But I guess that's just what you have to do to run the business.
Marisa Huston :It's what everybody else is doing.
Sarah Santacroce :Exactly!
Marisa Huston :So, I figure, hey, everybody else is saying free. Everybody else is saying limited seats. Everybody else is saying limited time and it's working for them so then you assume it's going to work for you.
Sarah Santacroce :And eventually, I think what happened to me is like, I just can't do it anymore. I feel like the fear of not showing up authentically of not being able to show up without the mask is bigger than the fear of failing the first few times. And so that's when I really got curious about this idea. What if we could do it our way? What if we gave ourselves permission to do it the more gentle way and use more creativity, use more beauty and just be ourselves? What if?
Marisa Huston :Yes, because now you're in alignment with your true self. You start to understand why you got into business in the first place, is to help people and to make a good difference for them and for yourself and for everybody to benefit. And when you are putting that in jeopardy, then you feel bad. At the end of the day, you know, it's not right and you feel it. What are some things then that our listeners can start to apply? Because as you know, this show is not just about awareness. Because now we've established what are the things we should be thinking about in our business when it comes to marketing? But it's also about encouraging our listeners to understand all facets of their decision so that they can take action. So that they can take even one baby step towards hitting their goals. What are some things we can share with them that they can start to apply to help them become a more gentle marketer and be more in line with their true self in terms of what they want to offer to the world to their customers and to the people that they touch in their lives?
Sarah Santacroce :Maybe when you're writing your next email copies or your next web page or putting up a webinar feel into whether that feels good the way you're doing it or if there's a certain things in your marketing, social media, facebook, etc, etc. where you're like, that actually doesn't feel good. I'm just doing it because I feel like I should be doing it. And so taking inventory of all these marketing tasks that we're supposedly have to do every day, right, and then saying, Okay, these things I actually like doing. For me, for example, I love doing my podcasts and so do you Marisa.
Marisa Huston :Yes!
Sarah Santacroce :So this is marketing. That's what we do. In a podcast, we're doing marketing. So that's one thing that we love. For me personally, engaging in a facebook group was never my thing. And I felt like I have to do it. And I've done it for many years. But eventually I just said no more. I don't want to do a facebook group anymore. And so just giving yourself that permission and kind of saying, I want to do more of these things that bring me joy, and less of these other things that I feel like I have to do. Another example is selling on webinars, like we have been told, and if you've ever attended a webinar that just made you cringe where it's like this long introduction about how great this person is. And then like 10 minutes of content, and then 20 minutes of sales pitch at the end, right. But that's what we've seen over and over again. So we're like, guess I have to do it this way. That's how it works. And then just kind of saying, well, what if I did it differently? What if I didn't actually have that long pitch at the end, and just shared really valuable content, and then invited people onto a one on one call with me if they were interested in pursuing this further. So really, just giving yourself permission to change little things that are kind of industry standards that we think we have to do and then say, you know what, I remember Sarah and Marisa, I'm going to do it differently and see what happens.
Marisa Huston :And I can relate so much, Sarah. It is so true. I think that these are guidelines, and we take them as set in stone. Because somebody else is doing it and it works for them, we assume it's going to be the same for us. But everybody's different. So for example, there are people that go to specific networking groups where they're exclusive, and some of them will swear by it. They'll say this is how I get 90% of my customers. For example, if they were doing, let's say Home Services, and there was a realtor, and there was a flooring person, and there was a electrician or whatever. They share information with each other, and they serve the same clients and they do really well. Whereas other people that go to the exact same event don't get any business whatsoever. And they're doing the same things, but it just doesn't fit their authenticity, or perhaps even the types of clients that they're trying to reach. So just because it works for one person doesn't mean it works for another. We need to be willing to pivot to adjust to make the changes that we need, and line it up with what we like. So to your point, Sarah, we both love to podcast. And I think part of the reason is because it is so authentic, it's so nice to meet new people and share information and just be ourselves. And this fits who we are. And I think that that's very important, because I think the universal theme is that we need to get out there. Like people need to know that Sarah exists. If they didn't see you anywhere, how would they even know that you have services to offer or what you're about? So with that being said, it's important to put yourself out there, but the way that you do it has to be in line with what makes you happy and what is in line with your brand as well, don't you think?
Sarah Santacroce :Exactly. And I think that's why when I looked at the seven P's of marketing, and completely remodeled them, because I thought...actually what really matters to us heart-centered entrepreneurs is to find clients who are aligned with us, with our values. That's why we were in business in the first place. And so what you just said is like finding out more about ourselves and who we are. And you and I are both introverts. No wonder we like podcasts, because we'd like to go deep into conversations and having conversations with one person rather than showing up on stage with 50 people. And so finding out more about yourself will then help you find out your marketing superpowers and really realize, Oh, I'm actually a really good connector and I actually like to create these communities on facebook in running this group. And you know, power to that. That's great! Everybody has to find their way. And you mentioned networking. Oh, gives me nightmares if I have to go out there and do networking. But other people are just really good at it. And finding out what works for you and then focusing in on that and saying no to most of the rest. Like we are also taught in marketing. Oh, you should be everywhere and you have to have now a podcast as well. And you have to do everything. No, you don't. Like one or two channels are enough. And that's where you're gonna be the best. Like me, maybe you as well...If you find us in networking, or probably hiding somewhere near the buffet or something. It's not our strength, right?
Marisa Huston :Yes. And I'm so glad you mentioned that Sarah. We are trying to do too much. And we think that we're supposed to do everything. I have to have a newsletter, I've got have a YouTube channel. Then I do a podcast. Then I've got to do this other networking thing. And you end up doing none of it well. You really just need to find that wheelhouse that makes you comfortable, that's a good fit for you, that'll still get you out there and then focus on that one. Hone in on that 100%. So I agree with you. I'm glad you've mentioned it. In terms of the seven P's, what are the other ones?
Sarah Santacroce :Yeah, so the seven P's are passion, personal power, people. The third one is when we finally after looking at ourselves, who we are, what our story is, what our values are, then we look at our people. And for me, our people are our ideal clients. And funny enough, often our ideal clients are kind of the mini me's. You know, they're very similar to us. They share the same values, they have the same worldview. So it's interesting to first look at ourselves and say, this is who I am and now I'm going to find people and attract people who are very similar to me, because that's where I get the best results. That's where I get the most joy out of business. For many, many years, I was working with the wrong clients in my LinkedIn consulting business. These were like very stiff businessmen and we had nothing in common. And so I was trying my best and I was putting on this mask. And here's, you know, really professional Sarah. And it just didn't work for me. I was not having fun anymore. So that's the third P. Then there's product, and for many of us is product or services. So that's where you then bring in more of you into your service descriptions into what you offer to your ideal clients. And marketing has a lot to do, like I said, with communication. And so words matter. How you say it, how you express it matters. What bothers me a lot in the current marketing paradigm is that we focus so much on people's pain. We say, got to find the pain and got to put the knife in the pain and make them realize they have a pain. I say yes, address that they have a problem. But then from there, go into the solution. Make marketing more positive, rather than you know, always talking about this pain. That doesn't make anybody feel good. Then pricing. You need to have a conversation about how we're going to price their services and products. Promotion is choosing a channel, where you're going to focus in as we discussed. And the last one I find is very important as well is partnerships. I think too often entrepreneurs are trying to do everything on their own. And so partnerships, like we're doing right here, this is a partnership, right?
Marisa Huston :Yes!
Sarah Santacroce :It's so much more joyful, and it belongs to marketing nowadays. I couldn't think of a way without it. It's so nice to be able to collaborate with like minded people.
Marisa Huston :Oh, and partnerships, to me is one of the most underused methods. Let's say you had a newsletter. When I talked to other entrepreneurs, I'll say, do you have a newsletter? And they say no. And I say, well, why not? And they'll say, because I can't come up with topics. Like I have to think every week of what to put out there and it's too much stress. and I don't want to deal with it. Not because it's not beneficial. Because it's just too much work, right? So I say to them, what if you didn't have to write a single article? What if you reached out to people that offer wonderful services that your audience would love to know about, and then you use their words and put them in your newsletter? You don't have to write 10 pages of a newsletter. You could just send your audience something that is of value, and they'll appreciate you. And on top of which you're now connecting them to some other person that they would have never had access to before. So you're creating this win-win situation. And that's really where the power comes in.
Sarah Santacroce :I have a Sarah Suggests part in my newsletter. That's where I always bring in, you know, other people that I appreciate and that I know that they'll serve my people, right. I always want to of course either know the person or know the program. And then yeah, it's all about the community and the collective and together we're stronger.
Marisa Huston :Yes. And the thing that I hear a lot, and I'm sure you hear this, too is...Well, I don't know that I can trust them. 100%. Like, they sound great and I like them and I've known them for a while and they seem to be great. But what if they drop the ball? What if they don't do what they say or whatever, then my customer gets angry? What then? Well, you know, there's a certain level of risk. You can't 100% guarantee with a person that things are going to always be perfect. People make mistakes. But if you're dealing with an individual that you know enough, that's going to make it right, or is going to do the right thing, then everything else will fall into place. And so yes, you have to be selective. You can't just bring anybody in there because your audience is expecting you to bring good people in front of them. But at the end of the day, that's risk. People are unpredictable and things happen. And you just have to trust that you are going with your gut and that you're doing due diligence. And after that you kind of have to let things happen and you can't be so controlling, right?
Sarah Santacroce :Human relationships are messy and business is messy sometimes and it's all good. I think what matters most is then the transparency of saying hey, look, sorry, really sorry, that didn't work out. I messed up. I didn't check this. And really just again, being transparent and honest with your clients.
Marisa Huston :The authenticity to me is, above all. If you are a good person, and you're really trying to offer a good service to people that is going to help them, then you're going to be successful. I truly believe that.
Sarah Santacroce :Just to come back, because you mentioned before, you know, how do we stand out from all these people who are doing the same thing? That's exactly how you stand out, right? Because I always say that people who are only after the price, they will always compare prices. And yes, they will always take the cheapest. But if people actually make a decision based on the relationship they have with you, or based on your worldview, and based on, like you said that you're a good person, and that they just want to be around you or support your mission. It's a whole different level of relationship, and you will not have these pricing discussions where it's like, oh, but can you you know, go lower, or. Maybe if they're in a bad situation, you will actually engage on that conversation and say, I understand, you know, maybe we can come up with a payment plan or something. You won't feel abused by this idea of always having to go lower. That is so tiring if you are an entrepreneur and you feel undervalued, you will burn out and not be able to maintain your business.
Marisa Huston :That's right, your pricing needs to match what's realistic in terms of how you can keep the doors open. But Sarah, there's always somebody out there, that's going to undercut you. Always. Right, that's a given. But they will notice the difference. They're not getting the responses or they're not able to get their questions answered appropriately, or the product may not be the same. And then once they realize that it's taking up more time and causing more frustration in their business, they'll realize that it's worth paying a little extra to get that good service.
Sarah Santacroce :They just haven't evolved in their journey, yet. They hadn't made the mistakes yet of paying an amateur a couple of times, and then realizing, oh, this is much more work than I thought.
Marisa Huston :That's right. This really gives a foundation in terms of what people can do to really make marketing, fun. Marketing not only effective, but really in line with our values for our businesses. Because again, we don't want it to be a dirty word. Marketing is a very important component of our success. And avoiding it is not an option. It's just one of those things you can't run away from because without marketing, you can't run your business. So how do we make it so that we don't dislike it so much that we don't think of it in that sense, but look at it more as a enhancement of who we are and how we're able to put ourselves out there in the world and help people. Sarah, can you tell our listeners exactly how they can get a hold of you and perhaps who your target audience is or some services that you provide to people in your business?
Sarah Santacroce :Yes, thank you for the opportunity. This has been so fun. My main website is www.sarahsantacroce.com. People can also go over to the Gentle Business Revolution TM. That's where I have a manifesto about the way I look at business and the way I want to see it evolving. And also my podcast. And finally, if people are interested in gentle marketing, there's www.thegentlemarketingrevolution com. That's an online course that I've put together and beta tested all of last year.
Marisa Huston :Sarah, thank you for your time and for sharing your knowledge with all of us. I really appreciate it.
Sarah Santacroce :It's been a delight. Thanks, Marisa for having me.
Marisa Huston :That's all for this episode of Live Blissed Out. Thanks for listening and thanks to Sarah Santacroce for being my guest. If you have a question or comment for a future episode, all you have to do is go to www.speakpipe.com/lbovm or click the link in the show notes to leave a brief audio message. If you find value in our show, please visit www.live blissedout.com to reach out subscribe and share on social media. This show is made possible through listeners like you. Thank you. So long for now and remember to keep moving forward!